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Talk:Timeline:March 2007

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Are we waiting for a reference point or are we stretched too thin to make this?--SacValleyDweller 18:44, 21 October 2007 (EDT)

  • We're waiting for a reference point. On what did you base these dates?--Hardvice (talk) 18:47, 21 October 2007 (EDT)
    • what dates? If you're talking about the links to here or the page between here and November 2006, it wasn't me. However given the title of the first episode, "Four Months Later," Season 2 (aside form Hiro's story of course) has to be at least March, 2007, and the placement of the dates in between has to be true.--SacValleyDweller 00:01, 22 October 2007 (EDT)
      • No, I meant the actual dates that got added. I didn't realize that was somebody else. Sorry about that. I was just wondering if somebody had discovered a point of reference that would allow us to lock down specific dates.--Hardvice (talk) 00:09, 22 October 2007 (EDT)
        • none the less, it might be good to at least bullet point the major events from each episode here to de-stub-ify the page--SacValleyDweller 02:03, 22 October 2007 (EDT)
      • Incidentally, it looks like the dates which were added were based off of the soccer match. It's kind of sad that that's our best point of reference. I think the producers and writers have learned their lesson from Season 1's timeline inconsistencies. They seem to be going out of their way not to give any specific dates.--Hardvice (talk) 00:12, 22 October 2007 (EDT)
        • Unfortunately so. We could ask about this in Behind the Eclipse.--SacValleyDweller 02:03, 22 October 2007 (EDT)
          • I still think that you can get some sort of date from the newspapers featured in the episodes. I don't have TiVo or HD recordings, so I can't see.--Bob (talk) 02:19, 22 October 2007 (EDT)
          • AC Milan wins Celtic 1:0 happened on March 7. This reference is clear enough for me. Chrisyu357 04:25, 23 October 2007 (EDT)
          • I asked, and got:
SacValleyDweller is back once again from the HeroesWiki needing even more detailed information. "Do we have na official, in-universe date for the start of Season 2 besides the known 1671 for Hiro's arc? Can we safely assume that the rest of the season 2 events occur precisely four months after November 8th? And are we going to get some flashbacks this volume? If so, which episode(s)?" Four months from November 8 – is March something or other – right? You can do the math. And if you want flashbacks – Episode 8 is titled "Four Months Ago" – taking you right back to Kirby Plaza… How's that for flashbacks?

so looks like we can start on this with all deliberate speed.--SacValleyDweller 21:00, 29 October 2007 (EDT)

March 20th

So the preview shows Peter saying something about March 20th. If this is the case, we know that FML takes place a week before CT. Finally, something to work with.--Bob (talk) 09:36, 21 November 2007 (EST)

So, we have our reference point. I have a big test to study for, so I dunno how available I'll be, but it shouldn't be that bad since we have some solid reference points from the last few episodes.--Bob (talk) 22:48, 26 November 2007 (EST)

March 23?

WHat Tells us that the events listed under March 23 happened on March 23?--SacValleyDweller (talk) 02:41, 7 May 2008 (EDT)


OK, what tells us that the events of Faces happen after March 23? --SacValleyDweller (talk) 13:03, 26 May 2008 (EDT)

  • The blurb for Faces, Part 1 reads "As Agent Dunlap finds herself tied tighter into Evs Dropper's mysterious plans, other agents continue down their own paths.". From that, we know 1) it's after Donna became an agent of the Company; 2) it's occurring as she becomes "tied tighter" to Evsdropper's plans... it's clear from that that the "tied tighter" reference refers to her finding the photo of Isaac's painting that depicts her death. That happens on March 23rd.--MiamiVolts (talk) 15:09, 26 May 2008 (EDT)
    • I'm not so sure that what you cite is enough to say so. It could be happening at the same time that Donna is captured/recruited into the company, or sometime else. --SacValleyDweller (talk) 15:48, 26 May 2008 (EDT)

When do we stop putting things in "After March 23 2007" and into "Post March 2007"? -- Friskymuffin - (talk)

  • When we get another clue that we are in April or later.--MiamiVolts (talk) 18:05, 10 July 2008 (EDT)

Jamie Wu's death

How do we know Jamie didn't die before March 9th? I think it would be clearer just to say that on March 9th, Jamie's dead body is discovered.--MiamiVolts (talk) 19:49, 9 May 2008 (EDT)

  • Well, of course there's always the possibility that she somehow was found freshly smoking, and moments after she was found the smoke cleared...but sure, leaving it as just "Jamie's dead body is discovered" fits. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 20:37, 9 May 2008 (EDT)
    • Thanks, I wanted to allow for the possibility that she was killed much (perhaps days) earlier and at the warehouse someone poured acid on her to make it look like Cushing has just killed her.--MiamiVolts (talk) 21:17, 9 May 2008 (EDT)

Berlin Now

The transport of The German from Berlin to Level 5 took place July 3 2008 3:18 AM: satellite shows the team got off the ground and is winging toward Level 5 as we speak.

  • Evolutions developments and Episode/GN (Aired) happenings are rarely synchronous, so we go by the Aired happenings. --SacValleyDweller (talk) 20:23, 8 July 2008 (EDT)

Cite parts?

It's probably a minor thing, but which is better stylistically and for the sake of completes, citing multi part GNs like this:

Root and Branch

Or citing each part of the GN, like this:
Root and Branch

--SacValleyDweller (talk) 18:26, 10 July 2008 (EDT)

  • I like this idea, I think it makes sense. -- Friskymuffin - (talk) 18:36, 10 July 2008 (EDT)
    • I'm fine with either as long as we're consistent.--MiamiVolts (talk) 18:45, 10 July 2008 (EDT)

On Reworking Post March 23

The latest GN makes the our Post March 23 entries a bit jumbled and hard to follow. Might this be reworked thusly? --SacValleyDweller (talk) 22:13, 19 August 2008 (EDT)

  • I don't see any point in splitting off the last part of Root and Branch. Is there anything to point that the other novels you list came before that split-off portion of Root and Branch?--MiamiVolts (talk) 22:47, 19 August 2008 (EDT)
    • OK, here's my rational:

1) A surface glance implies that the order of the GNs is the order of happenings.
2) It is stated in the blurb at the beginning of The Kill Squad, Part 1 that Junior and Donna are in Virginia while Gael and co. are in Berlin, therefore these events are happening ca. the same day.
3) Sabine could have taken Hartsdale clone to Utah while Gael & co. were in Berlin and Junior & Donna were in Virginia.
4) The big bag and tag has to have happened before the Berlin mission, as Devin is alive in Australia and is dead in Berlin.
5) Hindsight is picking up right where a few of the GNs left off: Donna shot Sabine's car in Root and Branch, Part 3, they are investigating the crash in this GN. Gael and Bianca, just having returned from Berlin, are livid that the German had company files, and are looking for answers. --SacValleyDweller (talk) 01:44, 20 August 2008 (EDT)

  • Berlin is already ordered after Root and Branch... also, we don't have any new info. on when the real-time events in Hindsight took place, or did I miss something?--MiamiVolts (talk) 01:59, 20 August 2008 (EDT)
    • That's the problem, and I think you are missing something. Here are the reference points I'm going off of to establish my rough version of the timeline: The blurb in Kill Squad 1 establishes that Berlin and parts 1 and 2 of The Kill Squad are happening concurrently, or close to it. In Hindsight, Gael talking about the German establishes that we are after Berlin. Since we are after Berlin, we are also after Kill Squad 1 and 2. We have Junior and Donna investigating Sabine's crash, which was at the end of Root and Branch, naturally establishing that we are after Root and Branch. The afore mentioned points involving Gael and Junior also establish that at least some of the events in Root and Branch happened concurrently with Berlin or afterward. --SacValleyDweller (talk) 03:14, 20 August 2008 (EDT)

Evs Dropper arc in 2008?

  • In an interview with Evs Dropper, Evs said "You'd be surprised how much information Matt Neuenberg was able to discover before he passed." This put the Matt Neuenberg arc (which is in 2008) before the Evs Dropper arc. Chrisyu357 05:17, 15 September 2008 (EDT)
    • Good call! -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 07:18, 15 September 2008 (EDT)
      • Awesome catch. I know it's sort of speculation, but I would agree that the evs arc happened after the Matt arc. However, there's content in the evs arc that runs simultaneous with episodes, which is Donna in the infirmary with Noah. There's no aired material that corresponds with the Matt arc, and that's why some people (myself included) never liked that it was placed in 2008. I think we can resolve the conflict by noting that in the first GN with Matt has the year 2008 shown in the background. Aside from that, I think it should be moved so we can get over this inconsistency. --Bob (talk) 15:26, 15 September 2008 (EDT)
        • I concur, I think the novels from Root and Branch, Part 1 onward need to move to 2009. We may know for sure if Ryan asks the timeline question I provided in his upcoming interview. When Donna is in the clinic with Noah, it is the day after Mohinder had shot him in the eye, so that novel and previous novels needs to remain about Feb/March/April 2007, imho, even though they're slightly Evs-related.--MiamiVolts (talk) 15:42, 15 September 2008 (EDT)
          • 2009 or 2007?? I think you mean 2007, yes?--Bob (talk) 18:04, 15 September 2008 (EDT)
            • No, I mean 2009. Based on Penny's age, everything after and including Root & Branch, Part 1 should be in 2009-2010. The part of the Evs arc before R&B1 should be Feb-April 2007.--MiamiVolts (talk) 18:21, 15 September 2008 (EDT)
              • See that makes it worse. What I was saying should be done is the following:
The evs-arc is established to start from when Noah was recovering from his eye-wound, which was March 19th, 2007. There's nothing that indicates otherwise that there is a large gap in time between all of the evs-arc.
The Matt-arc needs to be moved prior to March 19, 2007, based on the indication that evs used information from Matt.

I think the age issue with Penny is just an inconsistency with age, similar to Claire. From spoiler indications, The German will escape from Level 5, meaning his capture occurs before Season Three starts. Moving forward in time complicates a lot of things, but moving back in time makes things fit. Season Three starts up right where Season Two ends, not 2 years in the future. --Bob (talk) 18:28, 15 September 2008 (EDT)

  • I do think it is possible that the writers are purposely setting up part of the arc as an alternate future that gets erased when Future Peter comes back from four years from the future and alters history. They could then take greater liberties, change things up and potentially kill off major characters. Remember, it's been done before: there were two graphic novels that were released about the alternate future in Five Years Gone in Season 1.--MiamiVolts (talk) 19:27, 15 September 2008 (EDT)
    • That's a bit lot speculative, don't you think???? This was a very large story arc, whereas the other two were very small (two were one parters, one was a two-parter). This story arc has developed over a month and a half of content, and I seriously doubt that they released this for it to not matter at all. The writers said somewhere that they are using some of the characters involved in this arc. I can't speculate, but I'd like to hear from other people, because I seriously doubt they made this HUGE story arc to be completely erased.--Bob (talk) 20:17, 15 September 2008 (EDT)
      • It's been done before. Dallas erased an entire season as a dream. With a show that jumps around like Heroes, I don't think it's speculative to follow show info. that suggests a large gap in time has passed. It's happening more often than not now that they're jumping around.--MiamiVolts (talk) 21:48, 15 September 2008 (EDT)
        • And Desperate Housewives just erased five years with a jump forward. But Dallas and DH were very explicit in their jumps, and it they were (are) both storytelling devices. Heroes has not done that, and nothing has been made explicit. Jumping ahead in years like that certainly happens, but it really doesn't happen "more often than not". I agree with Bob. It really doesn't sit well with me thinking that Donna was captured in 2007, and then two years later all these events go down with Evs Dropper. (That's a long time to just happen upon Donna's cell phone outside Primatech Research!) I think it's simply a case of two mistakes: The banner in The Man with Too Much Brains very well may be an artist's mistake (or even a writer's mistake, considering the writers were fill-ins during the writers strike and are execs for NBC, not writers--Carri Wagner has told me she's not very familiar with all the "ins and outs" of Heroes), and Penny's age on the assignment tracker map is probably an oversight. I will certainly ask Timm and Jim to clear it up a bit for us. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 21:56, 15 September 2008 (EDT)
          • I think the timeline has been very vague since the Season Two finale. If you can get clarification, it would be much appreciated, thank you.--MiamiVolts (talk) 22:32, 15 September 2008 (EDT)

Enter Volume 3

Gael and Bianca were killed on March 20 (same day as the press conference, Claire calling Peter, and Sylar attacking Claire.) Hence, Root and Branch Part 3, the end of The Kill Squad Part 3, Hindsight, Foresight, and Into the Wild take place by March 19 (nighttime.) The Kill Squad Part 3 spans 155 hours, so it started by March 13. Obviously this was after Donna's canceled first assignment, which would have been on her fifth day, as stated in Career Choices. This means she was recruited by March 9. The day before this, Bennet says he was shot the day before that (by March 7.) Wow. Josh 21:59, 23 September 2008 (EDT)

  • It just doesn't add up. Donna is placed next to Noah - this would happen after Truth and Consequences. Truth and Consequences and Powerless are at most 1 day away, and the Second Coming picks up instantly where Powerless has ended. Thus, Truth and Consequences and the Second Coming are at most 2 days away. We know that Into the Wild is prior to the Second Coming because Gael and Bianca are killed in the Second Coming. This means that everything happening in the GN - from Donna's Big Date to Into the Wild, all happens in 2 days. Chrisyu357 10:35, 24 September 2008 (EDT)
    • Assuming every scene in one episode takes place before every scene in the next episode, which is proving increasingly impossible. Josh 11:33, 24 September 2008 (EDT)

Company arc during hiatus

I think we should remove them and place them in a continuity-noted section on this page. It's apparent that the whole arc isn't synced with the televised timeline. Gael and Karina die on the 23/24th, so that arc occurred between the 19th and the 23th. 4 days. Either there's a lot of editing to be done, or there's a massive continuity error.--Bob (talk) 17:41, 26 September 2008 (EDT)

Speaking of continuity errors, in "The Second Coming," when Sylar's looking through Noah's box of Level 5 dossiers while Claire is hiding in the closet, there's already a dossier in there for the German. The German wasn't captured and locked up in Level 5 until after Noah was being kept away from his home, so Noah's files at home shouldn't be that up-to-date. - Only3Penguins

Timeline as theory pages

  • Ok, based on the delay in Ryan's Into the Wild interview and the response I got from this week's Behind the Eclipse, I think it's looking more and more like we might not get an answer as to when the Company arc occurred or if it occurred. In addition, the BTE appears to have confirmed my theory that fixed dates in general look to be going away. So I think the timeline will become meaningless as a concrete notion in terms of dates and I guess that's how the writers want it (they can't be accused of date errors if there's no dates to go by). Thus, I think we may have to start organizing it solely in terms of events; either that, or we each keep our own theory pages as to what actually is going on. SVD already started with his own version of the Company arc timeline. Those are my current thoughts on the matter.--MiamiVolts (talk) 00:58, 1 October 2008 (EDT)
    • Check it out!...As for making these theory pages--a strong strong no, if that's what you're suggesting. The timeline is very heavily linked throughout the site. Just because there are some continuity errors does not mean that the entire timeline is bunk. What it simply means is that we don't include the information that's contradictory. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 02:13, 1 October 2008 (EDT)
      • Actually, making it into a theory is a last resort; I was suggesting grouping by event when the event has no date reference (we could call it Timeline:Miscellaneous events?) or we don't yet know where to place the event. The creative leeway the writers are asking for is tough to give, especially with a show that can be hard to comprehend at times for the lay viewer. That said, we will be getting more and more event times that are vague such as "sometime ago" or just "X years in the future". That makes time jumping difficult to figure out, as it might not always be linear. And less info. means more speculation. As for the Into the Wild interview, the writers didn't help us that much except to confirm that the Company arc was supposed to end up about the time Season 3 started (I'll assume they forgot about 2011 part at the beginning). We can probably use SVD's timeline as our own best guess on how the arc should have laid out, but since the Company arc novels are not in order of release it will be just our best guess. That's my 2 cents.--MiamiVolts (talk) 03:31, 1 October 2008 (EDT)
        • I was the one who formatted the timeline the way it is, and I have to say that the timeline has been something I pay close attention to since it's my little wiki baby. I like the notation that is currently in place, where we distinguish the continuity error in a different section. This notes the dates that have been given through near-canon sources (GN's), but still maintains the canon sources and near-canon sources that fit. I don't think we need to deviate further from that. It seems fixed to me, since we've shown that the writers of the GN's didn't match up correctly with the plot, so we note it. It's done, so I don't see what else needs to be done. Looks great to me.--Bob (talk) 05:07, 1 October 2008 (EDT)
          • Totally agree. It looks fine, and the only thing we need to really do is update as we get new events. I guess I saw the title of this thread ("Timeline as theory pages") and comments that we're going to have to start keeping our own theory pages about the timeline, and I wanted to make sure that we're not thinking about changing how we do the timeline. Basically, we put what we know in the timeline, and the stuff we don't know is either omitted or put in a Notes section, like it is now. I think it's great the way it is. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 08:31, 1 October 2008 (EDT)

Remenber what Angela said, "Peter you changed the future as we know", she misght have been talking about the events on the graphic novels what we we're seeing was what should have happened instead. But it didn't because Future Pettrelli 2 changed, maybe sylar wasn't even supposed to find Claire or something or else he wouldn't go to the company neither he would have met Elle, thus no bandits. At least that's what i think (Manwithnoname 09:52, 4 October 2008 (EDT))


"Powerless" March 20th

Do the events we saw in "Powerless" necessarily need to have occurred on March 20th? The March 20th date came from a flyer that Peter acquired from a timeline in which the virus was released. Peter then returns to the present, armed with the knowledge of this potential March 20th release of the virus. But couldn't Peter's subsequent actions as a result of having seen this future alter the timeline in such a way that he and Adam actually get to the vault before the 20th? - Only3Penguins

  • In that episode, Peter says, to Hiro, "I went into the future. There's a virus. It kills almost everyone. And it starts here. Today." Peter knew the virus started on March 20, so those events must happen on March 20. Additionally, the original story was supposed to see the virus actually be released, further confirming that that was actually March 20. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 10:44, 1 October 2008 (EDT)
    • Ah, well then. Forget what I said. But we have to ask now: in the series' continuity as it exists now, post-strike, how did March 20th play out in the timeline where the virus was released and what actually accounts for the virus being released in one timeline and not in the other? What caused the difference?
      • The change in events happened because Peter went into the future, saw what would happen if the virus was released, and he worked to stop it. In the events as we know them, Peter was successful. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 11:07, 1 October 2008 (EDT)
        • Still leaves the question of how all of this played out in the timeline where the virus WAS released. If Peter wasn't tagging along with Adam in order to stop a virus he'd seen in the future, then what was Peter's involvement with the events of March 20th in that timeline?

Powerless and The Second Coming

Just rewatched the season 3 sneak peek on the season 2 DVDs, and Sendhil Ramamurthy says that most of the events in The Second Coming take place three days AFTER the events of Powerless (other than the obvious, like the shooting, etc). Isaacthepainter 14:52, 22 October 2008 (EDT)

Holy crap, density

Just realizing that the entire second volume seems to take place over the course of 10 days, as does the entire third volume. Good lord. --Ricard Desi 16:25, 13 December 2008 (EST)

IStory timeline

Why there it isn't here? It is near-canon, like GN Henryp 15:00, 30 December 2008

  • Do we know when it occurs? If so, feel free to add it. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 16:03, 30 December 2008 (EST)
    • As far I know, they happen at the same time than the episode of the week when they came out Henryp 15:35, 1 January 2009
      • Is there any evidence of that? -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 15:42, 1 January 2009 (EST)
        • Yes, the character meet Tracy at the time of episode 9, an eclipse happen at the same time than the episode, and end at the same time too. The Arthur's army appear too. Henryp 19:33, 2 January 2009

Assumptions

Where did we get the idea that each episode of Season 3 takes place one day apart? - Josh (talk/contribs) 20:02, 2 January 2009 (EST)

  • They don't. Several of them take place on the same day. The entire span of the third volume is just a few days. -- RyanGibsonStewart (talk) 20:20, 2 January 2009 (EST)
    • We shouldn't assume like this. I mean, in Season Two, is it possible that Hiro spend only a few days in feudal japan while it seems like he has been there for months? The same for Peter. Peter should have been in Ireland for weeks. All the timeline after Volume 1 just isn't right. I don't think its even close. It might be even be mid-2008 in the Heroes universe now. --JLYK 16:06, 1 May 2009

Please

Can we please stop assuming every storyline in an episode takes place simultaneously (e.g. that Bennet was shot while Adam and Peter were talking in Montreal), and dismissing anything that contradicts that assumption (e.g. Donna Dunlap's storyline showing that several days passed between those events) as a self-contradiction? - Josh (talk/contribs) 16:16, 13 January 2009 (EST)

graphic novels

it's so painfully obvious that all of the events in the graphic novels happen before the firt episode of volume 3 there is nothing inside of the graphic novels wich says the contrary except their data release --Manwithnoname 19:17, 12 June 2009 (EDT)

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